An Edit Feature

Hi guys,
Let me first congratulate you on the stupendous job that you have done. Bravo!

I would like to make a feature request, on this occasion. Could you please add an 'Edit' feature for files? I haven't seen that in SmartFTP. That means, when you right click a file on the server's contents, SmartFTP downloads a temporary copy of it, and opens it in the default editor. Once the file is modified and saved, and the editor is closed, the file is automatically uploaded. That is indeed very handy for counters, changelogs, and other ASCII files. Please consider it.

Thank you.

Great Idea

Hi,

First post here!

Seems like a very complete FTP app but the only thing stopping me from using it is not having the ability to edit remote files!

This is the feature I use the most in CuteFTP Pro and need it. Other FTP clients that support this feature require you to do your changes and only uploads the edited file when you close the default text editor, which I find very annoying.

If this feature is to be be implemented in the future, it would be nice if there was the option to save the file while keeping the document open so other changes can be done without having to right click, redownload the file again. Don't know if you follow...

Anyways keep up the good work and when this feature exists, I will be sure to try it out!

indeed, I have A webbased filemanager on my server where I can edit my files, but I would like to edit them with SmartFTP, 'cause I think it's much faster than A webbasted editor

why is it this hard to just download the file, edit it and reupload it?
dont be this lazy.

darix

Hi,

Once you get used to this option, you miss it!

Everybody looks to find ways to do things quicker and this is one of them!

Have you ever edited a file locally, uploaded it and realized it was an old version? 8O This eliminates that...

To each his own.....

I don't think you have to justify yourself for an enhancement request in the right section The Devs will consider it and include it or not ...

why is it this hard to just download the file, edit it and reupload it?
dont be this lazy.

darix
I edit a file veeeeery often.
Than it will be something like:
download
edit
upload
edit
upload
edit
upload
etc.

i woud like to edit it on the server because it's much faster

I love SmartFTP, but would really love it if it could do the editing trick with UltraEdit. UE is the mother of all editors, but it sucks as an FTP tool by itself. If SFTP could open the file with UE (as it does now), but also somehow pass along the fact that this is an FTP file, that would be the bomb. Maybe it's a change that needs to be done in UE as well, to accept this information.

uedit has an ftp feature builtin ... *remind*

darix

uedit has an ftp feature builtin ... *remind*

darix

that's the smartftp feature enhancement board not the uedit promotion board *remind*

Yeah, but UE rox

A feature such as Edit File for editing files directly on the server is convenient to have especially for UNIX files since you can retain ownership (user and group) of the file you are modifying. If you download and upload, you lose the original settings if you are logged in as someone else.

This is one advantage of WS_FTP, however I would like to see this on SmartFTP.

mark3m thats not correct. the ownership only changes if you upload a new file.

darix

Darix, I stand corrected. Downloading and uploading by overwriting the original file on the UNIX box of the same name will not change ownership.

However, an "on-the-fly" editing feature (right click, edit file which opens a temp copy of the file in a text editor that you can save) of files directly on the server will greatly enhance SmartFTP, IMHO.

Regardless, this is a SmartFTP Enhancement Requests forum isn't it??

It doesn't matter if it just brings up a window with a text field, a send button and a close button and that's it. It would still be an exceptionally useful tool especially when writing php scripts and the like - just hit "send" and then refresh the browser.


why is it this hard to just download the file, edit it and reupload it?  
dont be this lazy.
why use an ftp client at all?
why is it this hard to just open a socket to the server and work from there?
dont be this lazy.

a built in editing feature would make it easier to edit files on the server.
"ease of use" are the words of the day. live with it.

you dont edit on the server.
in download the file is downloaded to a temporary file.
opened in some rudimentary editor.
saved locally.
reuploaded the file.

darix

As a web developer who spends most of his time working from Windows boxes these days, the lack of being able to edit files located on remote servers is the one feature I miss the most in SmartFTP. There may be other, higher priority issues with SmartFTP that need to be addressed that I am far from aware of, but I feel remote editing capability is one of the best assets any developer could have in an ftp program. I've read here some personally recommending we migrate to some text editor or another that they appreciate. I feel this sort of direction misses virtually all of the reasons that remote file editing is so important.

In at least one instance someone stated that anyone who didn't appreciate the simple process of "download, edit and upload" (or something like that) as being part of the basic job of the web work ...was simply lazy. I don't mean offense by this but to me, that comment sounded like something someone who has only worked with relatively simple web sites running on Windows servers and/or was otherwise rather inexperienced in this area would say. I can't imagine anyone who has ever done much with web sites, large or small would say such a thing. From simple template-based sites to enterprise level, megabuck, international web sites and particularly ones running on one of the UNIX variants out there that constitute the majority of what is running the internet, such a statement seems to me, at best, unknowing.

How many in this discussion thread have had a 100 or a perhaps a thousand files that needed some hand-coded mods. These same files may have had thirty or forty important databases that depended upon those items you needed to work on? Then consider that some of the files are html, some php, some css, some xml, some perl, some on multiple servers...oh why bother going on with the list. If you have place/situation similar to the one I'm talking about, my guess is that your first thoughts were that you did not that wish to have to start your work by choosing between making a copy of your own local backup files and reworking those, or downloading and saving all those files needing rework off the remote server to your hard drive to some new directory, modify them all, then upload the new versions back to the server.

Firstly not just because all of those options are time-consuming, prone to error creation and just downright stupid, but secondly, if the changes needed affect various files system wide then you know mostly likely have to replicate in part if not the entire directory structure of the site (choosing between one of several ways) just to buy yourself a bit more insurance that your work will be executed and work properly. Now to the situation we are already considering, let's imagine that the entire workload hat to be assigned to not one, but ten people in order to assure that all the tasks involved would be completed by a stated deadline.

Then thirdly, once you (or all of you) have finished your downloading, organizing, editing and uploading, you are practically home-free because all you have left to do is spend a considerable amount of time checking the site and your work inside/out and from top to bottom to insure you can catch and repair whatever file permissions or other functionalities your newly edited and uploaded Windows files broke on your revised site! This is the norm, not the exception.

Remote editing eliminates the need for nearly all of this additional work and tedium. It also tremendously reduces the incidences of several kinds of errors which can/will occur and will need to be handled a fashion that in itself will require the time of a fair number of people, most of whom had nothing to do the problem that was created. One of the best benefits of remote file editing is that you won't get that feeling that is similar to what you would have if every time you needed a little fire, you knew were going to have to go find a couple sticks to rub together.

I'll share something else with you. It doesn't matter to me if it is a dinky little prefab one-page site; it is always nicer to be able to make your coding changes remotely. The most simple but wonderful reason for this is that if I make a change to a file via remote editing and something on the site breaks, then 99.99% of the time I am going to know it is going to be because I screwed up somewhere. All I have to do is figure out what I I did wrong and fix it... why should I be ranting on this though ...mostly preaching to a choir that already understands what I'm saying. Right!

Hmmm, probably not. Probably wrong huh? See, I'm willing to stick my neck out there now and again that may result in me cutting my own throat one day. ...But I'll be damned if I'm willing to let some faceless corporation, POS software, 4x4 boss or anything/body else do it. I prefer to live and die by my own hand. So that tends to give a low BS tolerance level for stupid things that I didn't ask for or give anyone permission to administer to me, but will hurt me.

To me, having to transfer files from a remote machine to mine in order to work on them is inefficient at best. Doing it with an OS like Windows that doesn't play or work well with others very often changes to category of the initiative from being work, to merely being in the realm of the ridiculous.

What blows me away is remote editing is not some newly undiscovered frontier. This editing capability has been available ...available hell, it has been standard in UNIX and Macintosh ftp apps for over a decade. The only PC/Windows ftp app I've used so far that offers this feature is CuteFTP Pro which costs $60 US and has what has seems to me the lousiest ftp transfer engine in the business.

I guess I've tried out and/or worked with pc ftp apps out that are considered at least half decent including all the fancy commercial ones like WS ftp, ftpVoyager, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc. For the most part they all seemed aimed at creating kinder, more gentle and less "user-hostile" ftp apps for folks who practically neither know or care anything about ftp and just this want this ftp thing virtually 100% of the time so they can download all the stuff they find on the net that they want that requires or works better with an ftp app. I guess that is where the big money is in ftp software dev. The solution companies sure don't seem to be spending much time directing their energies toward what would be great tools for developers. Maybe somehow I missed the killer Windows dev ftp app out there. If so, please someone let me know about this.

In at least as much of what I've read in this discussion thread so far, there are a number of folks here who may not have a lot of experience with remote server work, or who belong to the remnant of victims who were sold "the universe revolves around Microsoft" myth and so simply don't understand why the issue of remote file editing being talked about here could be so important. I feel the same would hold certain whether it is in regard to ftp, telnet or some other protocol.

For myself, I feel compared to other the other ftp apps I've worked with, if SmartFTP had a remote text editor, there wouldn't be another program in this pc market segment that could hold a candle to it ...that is to say, at least until the others start pouring bucks into copying your new thing since a lot of developers would be dumping their stuff for yours. It is a lot of fun being the golden goose isn't it.

I hope I've not come across as rude to anyone in this post. That certainly hasn't been my attention. In long-winded fashion, I've simply put in my vote for the next big, important feature I would like to see in this program. Otherwise, I have said all I care to spend time saying about all this subject and would now prefer to be left alone. So, instead of buggin' me, show your support for this fine SmartFTP development effort. I feel this is one of those fairly rare pc projects that you can see the energy, creativity and power of motion gathering around like a corona. It reminds me of the work I do with do with some darn good open source projects out there. So whatever future development choices you folks doing all this work choose ...more power to you.

Suggestion bumped.

BUT... to each his own .... I wouldnt use the feature period.

Reason: Being a cautious developer, I would ALWAYS make a backup copy of the original file before making any changes in case I need to revert quickly... which you couldnt if edited directly on the server

Editing on the server for serious/bizzy/ecom websites is a crazy proposition at best, even if it requires downloading 500 files.

Suppose you need to make the same change in 500 files?? one by one on server?? :roll: Time is important around here.

Suppose you make a change to one file that affect how other files work? ure cooked.

Any dept head who suggests editing files on server without a local copy has no right being in that position, and the dope who carries out his instructions and screw up will be out the door, not him.

Theres more reasons why I wouldnt use it too.. but the above alone would stop me cold.

webM

important sites use kind of version managment ;)

darix

I feel there are a some important thing I could have/should have mentioned more clearly in my original post that I simply didn't. Sorry about that. Please also know that I have taken no offense at all to the criticisms made toward my first post. Many good points were made and much of it was well taken. So let me now mention a few things which may or may not clarify why I stand as an advocate for the ability to remotely edit files, that I should have mentioned previously.

1) I was almost exclusively referring to new site setups. For example, I am getting ready to set up three new sites for some folks that will all be using Moodle, eCommerce, PHProjekt, PHPNuke, EZPublish, Movable Type, phpBB, Typo3 as well as some other stuff like dedicated CRMs and live support.

2) Those site components will be uploaded in tarball or zip format and expanded on the nix/apache server so that the unix file and directory permissions will not be obliterated by my WinXP box. If I was working on Windows servers these sorts of permission concerns wouldn't be an issue of course, but I work almost exclusively on unix setups.

3) Once the files are online, they will not be available or accessible to anyone except those working on them until the work and testing over there is finished and the sites are ready for release. So I really wasn't discussing sites already in use so much. In case of working sites, any new implementation is built and tested on the server "off to the side" so to speak. They are usually adjacent to the thing(s) that will be replace and plugged into the working site only when it is ready for usage.

4) I probably should have also mentioned that, yes I agree with you, one should always work with replicants of original files. It is a given. Additionally, whether the site is available to visitors yet or not, version management for every item coded on the remote server is always used backed up both remotely in compressed form and current locally in both compressed and uncompressed versions. I'm not quite sure how I may have given the impression that these important things were not considerations and common practice on my part.

Unfortunately, the uncompressed version of the site on my pc that I have downloaded will have obliterated all the unix permissions set on every file and directory in it so there is no way I am going to recode 500 of those pages, upload them and then spend a great deal of time resetting the nix permissions on each one. I generally use the local, uncompressed version so that I can have an uncompressed version on my machine for simple file replacements occasionally or simply look at some of the code locally if I wish.

The simple fact is whether I break something that was built on the remote server or on my machine from an upload, I am going to have to replace that file with either the original or a new version derived from the original.

The speed that I can perform work by simply working directly on the remote server is always faster for me than creating a copy of a local file that I modify, then upload, reset permissions on and check for functionality. Once I've finished the remote work then of course it is backed up and archived. Working directly on the server simply saves me tons of time.

Yours,

d@yWorks

i work as webmaster/unix admin/script coder all day. but i have a ssh shell most of the time o.O and i dont want an edit feature in my ftp client o.O

darix

Those UNIX gurus should consider using command line FTP clients or SCP for not having clients with features they don't want. :twisted:

But for all the others - like me - such an edit feature would definitly be a great enhancement. We have a test system for example which I want to use just the way I use my personal workstation.

hehe ... im far away from a guru. :)

for me the main reason against a builtin editor:
- lack of syntax hilighting.
- not really configurable (e.g. short cuts)
- missing adv. functions like folding

why should the reimplement all those features?

think about the "unix" way:

a set of small specialized tools you combine to solve complex problems.

for me that means: a good working FTP Client + my special editor with all i need.

i really dont see a reason too bloat every application.

why do i need e.g. an Instant messenger with mail reader and winamp control which cooks my food while reading my news papers loud.

if you want this: choose emacs ;)

darix

i dont think it will be hard for smartftp to watch the file and see when a change has been made, it could be opened with whatever editor you want.

this owuld be an awesome feature!

It is these types of "features" that lead to program instability. SmartFTP is an FTP client. Not a babysitter, file edit facilitator, or mind reader.

I say keep it simple.

Sure UNCLE, let's just replace EVERY page with a navigation table on them EVERYTIME we need to add or edit a new link. Yes, let's waste an hour doing so. You're so smart.

Whats that got to do with anything in this thread takhi?

^Bump for this feature

I'm moving from LeapFTP and it had this feature, just like many other FTP clients out there. darix, before you start trolling this Enhancement Request thread anymore, if you don't like it, no one is forcing you to use it. Editing files via the ftp client is a fairly common feature and as you can see, there are many other users who are requesting it.

It was said earlier, once we get accustomed to features, we miss it. Also there was the post about
  • download
  • edit
  • upload
  • repeat
    • It's not like we're asking for an uncommon feature.

      darix, please keep your thread crapping to yourself. Thanks.

Why is there any need of an discussion?
You might use the feature if it will be ever implemented or not :/
I would like an "edit"-Feature too!

I would really love this in SmartFTP

Iddi:
I agree with every point you made. For me, the FTP's editor is not typically intended to be a full-blown editor. Why? Because most servers kick us out after 5min of "inactivity" (ie: while we're editing the code) even if we try to trick the server with random anti-idle commands, at least mine does. However, wouldn't it be a lot easier to tell SmartFTP which editing utility to use than having to make a built-in version?

right-click > edit > save to temp > open editor of choice > save/close > confirmation prompt (upload changes/cancel) > done

zer0fill wrote:
However, wouldn't it be a lot easier to tell SmartFTP which editing utility to use than having to make a built-in version?
Brilliant idea!
Why should the devs spend time re-inventing the wheel when they can empower users to work with their editor of choice. I reckon you as a user only have to make the appropriate changes in Smart's settings and off you go. Yet another proof that the best solutions are often the simple ones Nice one, zer0fill.

zer0fill wrote:Because most servers kick us out after 5min of "inactivity" (ie: while we're editing the code) even if we try to trick the server with random anti-idle commands ...
Very true, but I think that Smart already has a solution to this! We all know that if we have been disconnected from a server, it is sufficient to drag and drop a file from a local window to a remote window to transfer the file. Smart will automatically connect to the server and get to the right directory without us ever noticing that we have been disconnected.

A similiar approach could be used for the external/built-in editor: let the user work as long as he wants with a file, if he has been disconnected simple reconnect and upload the temp. file to the correct directory.

However, using Smart this way (i.e. not having to deal with local files at all) could be dangerous as you would not have a backup or could not undo changes. But I don't regard this as a good argument for not including the edit feature as Smarty's job is not to babysit the user.

That's a good idea: Have SmartFTP auto-reconnect and upload the temp file we edited if we got disconnected.

I'd also REALLY REALLY like this feature - to be able to double-click on a file in SmartFTP, edit it with my default editor (in my case UltraEdit), and then have the ability to automatically upload the modified file back to the server.

This is something I had with FlashFXP, a great feature. The way they accomplished it was after downloading the file and automatically opening it in your default editor, they threw up a dialog window for when you wanted to upload the modified file. So you edit it, save it (in the same location/temp directory that you downloaded it into), and when you click on the "ok" button in the dialog window, it automatically grabbed the file from the temp directory and uploaded it. If you didn't want to upload the modified file, you simply clicked "cancel".

From reading this discussion, it sounds like a lot of users would like this, and this feature seems fairly common amongst the other big FTP tools. In my opinion, SmartFTP should have it as well. For those that don't think they'd use it, simply don't use it. Let the rest of us have the convenience we want.

Feature added on SmartFTP Dev. build 1.0.984.0

Incredibly great!
The new feature combined with the ability of smartFTP to reconnect is marvellous!
I disable the StayConnected and SmartFTP is the first FTP client i find that simply reconnects if connection was lost.

:arrow: Would there be a way to have multiple files opened for edit?

And oh! The beep sound doesn't trigger when auto-upload.
It would be nice to hear the good transfer or bad transfer sounds like in manual upload...

Multiple file edits is planned for v2.0


-Mat

I don't know enough english to express my gratitude, your are wonderfull!

Thank you very much for the nice edit feature!

Any news of the Multiple file edits yet ?
I didn't find it in my 2.0.1000.x.
Thanks.

Hello ..

This is already possible:

- Stop the Transfer Queue
- Download the files you want to edit if they aren't on your local computer yet.
- Add the files you want to edit to the Transfer Queue for upload
- Then right-click on the transfer queue item, select "Schedule" from the context menu
- In the "Schedule" dialog enable the "Monitor File" option. Click OK.
- Start the Transfer Queue

Now every time you change the local file it will automatically be uploaded to the remote server. After you finished editing the file, remove it from the Transfer Queue.

Regards,
-Mat

Thanks very much mb!
I MUST try that next time I need it!
I need it sometimes.